Board Thread:Lore Discussion/@comment-110.32.195.239-20130628044602/@comment-1687225-20141104123825

I posted on the speculation that the dude at the bottom of the tower was a soldier in Havel's army, not Havel a long time ago. I'll repost my original argument here:

"...It is true that the ring is said to be worn by Havel's followers. But ENB [EpicNameBro, who was the one who popularized the soldier-not-Havel theory] neglects to mention that the weapon and shield that the unknown soldier wields belongs specifically to Havel the Rock. In particular, the shield is stated to be a truly "divine" heirloom, so it's not likely that one of havel's soldiers would have just been carting that slab of rock around like it's no big deal.

ENB mentions that you find his armor later in Anor Londo, suggesting that Havel had died a long time ago and the soldier in the watch tower wasn't havel, but we've seen other places where armor and the individual are seperated while still having the individual's identity verified. For example, the Darkmoon Knightess is certainly the Darkmoon Knightess (or the Lady of the Darkling as she is somewhat nonsensically known as by the community) as she drops a firekeeper soul that is specifically labelled "Soul of the Darkmoon Knightess", yet her armor set, the Brass set, is found after defeating Gwyndolin in a completely different location.

Further proof, although this one's more flimsy, is the Watchtower Basement Key's item description. The key opens the door that leads to the guy wearing havel's armor using havel's divine heirloom weapons. It states that a HERO was locked in there by a dear friend (by the way, we know that Gwyn and Havel are dear friends from Havel's Ring's description. In fact, they are some of the very few characters to have been mentioned as friends with each other at all). We know that Havel's a hero, but his soldiers were not necessarily as renowned throughout the land. It also wouldn't make sense to have this much lore at this point devoted to one lowly footsoldier that we don't hear anything more of."

By the way, someone mentioned that Havel and Andre were the same build, speculating that this means they are the same person. This is incorrect. Havel has the same build as the player (why else would players look identical to Havel in every way when wearing his armor?), while Andre is MUCH bulkier and well-muscled than said player. And the whole Andre is using his fists because he lost the Dragon Tooth thing is merely speculation that cannot be classified as evidence with a straight face.